A support group in Finland is concerned about the shunning practices of Jehovah's Witnesses
A support group in Finland is concerned about the shunning practices of Jehovah’s Witnesses

A Finnish non-governmental organization (NGO) has issued a report to the country’s Ministry of Justice calling for an investigation into the judicial practices of Jehovah’s Witnesses – specifically the practice of shunning as a punishment meted out by judicial committees.

According to its official website, one of the stated aims of the UUT (the Support group for the Victims of Religions) is to ensure that “religious communities would obey the law and respect human rights acts declared by the United Nations.”

They also insist that members of religions “should also have the right to leave the community without threats or fears of retaliation.”

On Saturday the group released a report criticizing the internal tribunals used by Witnesses, and the way those deemed punishable by disfellowshipping are “harassed, bullied, publicly reviled and isolated from loved ones.”

Justice Minister Anna-Maija Henriksson will be looking into the report
Justice Minister Anna-Maija Henriksson will be looking into the report

The report cites firsthand accounts from 18 former members as evidence of the harsh penalties that can be imposed. Shunning is identified as a practice that is “exceptionally cruel and a violation of human rights,” which can lead to severe health problems and even attempted suicide.

When asked about her immediate reaction to the report, Justice Minister Anna-Maija Henriksson expressed her concern about the idea of two judicial systems operating side-by-side in Finland.

“Of course it cannot be in Finland that we have another system outside the regular judiciary,” she said.

“It’s extremely important, also in religious communities to respect fundamental individual rights and freedoms. And that also includes thinking about our own behavior and practices from the perspective of respecting others.”

Henriksson admitted to reporters at “yle” that courts are the final authority on whether or not the organs of a religious group are operating legally or illegally, but she indicated that she would be looking into the UUT report in greater detail and may discuss the matter with the minister responsible for church matters.

Finland currently has around 18,700 Jehovah’s Witnesses. The Finnish Branch also manages organizational affairs for Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania – all countries whose own branches have recently been closed down.

Here at JWsurvey we applaud the UUT for its bravery in addressing this important issue, and we call upon similar organizations in other countries to follow its lead.

Article 18 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights clearly stipulates that everyone should be free to leave his or her former beliefs if they so choose. The practice of shunning those who disassociate themselves from the organization as implemented by Watchtower in 1981, and the breaking up of families through coercion that this entails, is a flagrant and obscene violation of these basic inalienable rights.

 

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Further reading…

116 thoughts on “Finnish NGO urges governmental investigation into Watchtower’s judicial policies

  • May 5, 2014 at 10:20 am
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    This is most encouraging. Sometimes and initiative by a small country will set a global trend. In 2004 Ireland was the first country in the world to ban smoking in public places.

    Were anti church court legislation enacted in the UK it would not only put JW Judicial committees out of business, it could also squash moves to operate Sharia and Beth Din courts amongst the Muslims and Jews.

    The Established Church still has consistory courts, but they are rarely convened and their powers are limited. Their final dissolution would simply be one more step on the UK’s raod to becoming secualr.

  • May 5, 2014 at 10:36 am
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    Yes, very encouraging to hear! Although you cannot make someone speak to you, (as I am sure many JW’s would still not speak to a DF person even with a “law” to follow) at the very least it could bring world attention to this horrible practice.

    • May 5, 2014 at 10:41 am
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      Very true, you cannot make someone speak to you. But in the case of Jehovah’s Witnesses, you CAN make someone NOT speak to his or her family. This is an extremely sadistic and cruel form of coercion, and like you I am thrilled it is gradually getting more exposure.

  • May 5, 2014 at 10:59 am
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    Someone should inform the Finnish government that JW practices have led to many ACTUAL suicides, not just attempts.

    I would, but I don’t speak Finnish.

  • May 5, 2014 at 11:13 am
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    Great work on the investigation of shunning. A glorious day indeed when governments are involved with this horrific practice.

  • May 5, 2014 at 11:40 am
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    I hope other governments will realise how this organisation denies people the basic right of leaving when they realise their believes are false. Many people by simply studying the Bible and history today understand that their believes are made up and speculative.

  • May 5, 2014 at 11:45 am
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    Shunning is hideous enough. Where Sharia law pertains, the penalty for renouncing Islam is death.

  • May 5, 2014 at 12:27 pm
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    Sharia makes those old [expletive deleted] at WT seem like club 18-30

  • May 5, 2014 at 1:27 pm
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    Well said…unfortunately, I know the family part all too well from first hand experience. It is a very cruel practice. Just wanted to say also, thanks so much for your blog. It’s great to have forum that speaks intelligently to all this nonsense we must deal with in regards to JW’s, especially family members.

  • May 5, 2014 at 1:44 pm
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    Cedars, we do have some suicide stats, but they still need some refining, and comparison with the general public. Thanks!

  • May 5, 2014 at 2:14 pm
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    OMG this is so great, I love finland. THANKYOU CEDARS FOR PUBLISHING THIS. BTW CHECK YOUR HANGOUTS ON GOOGLE PLUS.

  • May 5, 2014 at 3:07 pm
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    Hi Cedars. Great article. I have studied and transcripted the Matthew Barrie Glasgow 2008 judicial case. Apart from the full transcripts, I wrote a thesis isolating at least 21 ethical and and human rights violations in the case. If you would like I can forward (for publication) all transcripts and/or my thesis which fully annotates the violations directly from the transcripts and explains why they are unbiblical (2 witnesses only can condemn a person, not the suspicions of ‘righteous’ elders).

    Please let me know if you’re interested.

    Thanks

    Frank

  • May 5, 2014 at 5:02 pm
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    Hopefully the Finnish government will actually investigate this shunning practice.

  • May 5, 2014 at 5:03 pm
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    My father died of a brain tumor (non JW) during a time when I was disfellowshipped. My mother and my brother (both JW’s) were not allowed to comfort me at his funeral. And yet many months later I was in a supermarket and came face to face with a JW who was also an old friend. “Hi” she said I was so shocked I reminded her she should not be talking to me. “I’m not ignoring you, you are my friend” and she gave me a hug. That stayed with me. However My husband and I made our way back to the ‘truth’ genuinely to regain Jehovahs forgiveness, and even after we were reinstated we were still shunned by many. Actually turning their backs on us at our first return assembly. When I tried to return to the ministry few would offer to help me. My daughter then 15 was also trying to make her way, but because she was my daughter, she was excluded from many gatherings. She left in the end and right behind her was me, my hubby never really made it back. That was 13 years ago. These days we always know when there has been a “bring them back to the flock” talk because we get called on and guess what we tell them to go away. Mum and I are fine now, and I do not hold any malice to her. After all I was just as manipulated myself until I came to the outside and started looking in.

  • May 5, 2014 at 5:16 pm
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    One of the sickly acts of hypocrisy of the WTBTS is that it itself appeals to the UN Declaration of Human Rights as a way of counteracting the push to remove its perceived rights to treat their adherents the way they wish (this is the organisation it referred to thousands of times as the ‘the beast that causes desolation standing in the holy place’). They do this by proclaiming any action against it as attempt to curtail the WTBTS’s ‘right to religious freedom.’

    The reality is that the present WTBTS judicial system is little more than a bullying attempt to enforce unity of doctrine. This requires the rape of an individual’s conscience. Oh, and it works!

    Frank

  • May 5, 2014 at 6:02 pm
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    Cedar needs to let us know how his family is treating him.

  • May 5, 2014 at 10:52 pm
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    Hey Cedars, I,m an Ex Jw from Kenya. Just recently stopped being one but not officially. I think i,m among the first individuals in Kenya to start realizing truth about the organization. I would so wish such news was published in this country coz many are still ignorant

    • May 6, 2014 at 12:31 am
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      @Jojo, I am from Rwanda and realized the truth about the organization 4 years ago and started speaking out! Be cautious, I have been attacked in different ways elders weaponizing my so called wife.

      Ponder on this:

      *** yb12 pp. 183-184 Rwanda ***
      During the persecution, only one brother compromised. When he put on the political badge, the non-Witness prisoners beat, kicked, and insulted him, calling him a coward. His wife, who was studying the Bible, asked him why he had not remained faithful. He later wrote a letter to the judges, telling them that he had made a mistake and was still one of Jehovah’s Witnesses. He even wrote to the branch office in Kenya to apologize. He is now serving Jehovah faithfully once again.

      This is a sadistic cult!!!

  • May 6, 2014 at 12:53 am
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    Good article.

    It is great that the Finnish judicial system may be doing something to stop shunning – an evil practice to say the least. I hope other EU countries take note of any outcome and apply the same standards if Finland set a precedent.

    On the hypothetical side – If Finland do decide shunning is against human rights would that open the flood gates for others (specifically in other EU countries) to sue the Watchtower Society if they are shunned after Finland make their ruling?

    Just wondering seems what happens in one EU country can usually be used in another even if the specific country’s high courts don’t agree there is the chance to appeal to the European courts as a final step.

    Hoping that Finland go through with this all the way and are able to fight through what will undoubtedly be a word-game defense from the Watchtower Society legal team.

  • May 6, 2014 at 2:23 am
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    I’m sure that our buddies at WT have got a whole range of legal excuses to work their way around it. I’m not really expecting much to come from this.

  • May 6, 2014 at 2:44 am
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    Folks,

    We need to separate the INDIVIDUAL right to associate or not associate, which is correct, with the ORGANISATIONAL shunning of ex Witnesses, which is wrong.

    The “Shepherding the Flock of God” secret elder’s manual clearly states that an individual who chooses to associate with a family member will suffer no official sanction, although they may be stripped of privileges. There is no disfellowshipping as a result.

    Now, the Watchtower and other publications tell the rank and file to shun and shun hard. They tell lying stories about how shunning is the right thing to do.

    This contradiction needs to be publicised.

    The end is approaching for this cult. New members are dwindling, and those in now have access to the truth about their religion for the first time.

    Another great article, Cedars!

    Peace be with you

    Excelsior!

  • May 6, 2014 at 3:37 am
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    Hi Rob.
    On many of Cedars videos he does mention his dad. It breaks my heart each time because you can see how hurt he is. He says he has lost his dad. I am so grateful to Cedars for being so strong. The horrible thing is , is that many have lost their families for BECOMING witnesses too.

  • May 6, 2014 at 5:25 am
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    I don’t know.. i might be just a bit depressed but my thinking is now along the lines of ‘if people are that dumb to allow 7 little old dudes in america to tell them who to talk to then are they even worth knowing..’ will legislation help? or just strengthen the ridiculous notion that satan is out to get them..

    I know i sound cold and my wife is in this cult.. but it seems like people are happy to be led. even if its stupid like this. It makes them feel like the chosen ones, like neo from the matrix.. im just bored of these grey people now.

  • May 6, 2014 at 5:26 am
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    JW will do everything again through the prism of their understanding of the Bible: “We must obey God rather than human beings!”…
    I think that the Finnish government has enough problems. Alcoholism among his nation, the constant influx of immigrants. It will be Good,if someone will pay attention to JW. However, the tolerance is too high in Finland…

  • May 6, 2014 at 6:18 am
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    I’m from South Africa. The line that those who leave are not shunned is an absolute lie. I have experienced it myself just a little while ago.
    I made the mistake of informing a long time friend of my decision to DA, he was incredulous, pleading, and then he became spiteful in the space of seconds. “I have ruined my sons chances of everlasting life” “I might still be able to come back if it’s not too late” The amount of fear and guilt he managed to squeeze in one paragraph was stunning.

    I am left crying and anxious and with one last jibe at me he removed me from his contacts. (This conversation was over Skype) I was polite, and respectful the entire way through, and he became very quickly mean, bringing my conscience and intelligence into question.

    I didn’t even go into my reasons, I was concerned not to stumble him! Though I cared about that, he didn’t care at all about his hurtful and harsh remarks. Practically saying I had doomed my son to death was uncalled for, an innocent child has nothing to fear from the loving father Jehovah.

    Since then I have reached out for support at AAWA, (awaiting a response with white knuckles) and I’m writing here just to keep my mind from imploding.

    Further proof – leaving = being shunned.

    Thanks for listening

  • May 6, 2014 at 7:58 am
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    I totally understand about being led by ‘7 little old dudes’ and the Watchtower Society turning this all around saying that Satan’s government is persecuting them and now is a time to be strong and stand up to them.

    But that is what cults do. They make you think exactly what they want you to think, do what they want you to do, and all the time make you believe that it is for your own good.

    As for the ‘are they worth knowing’ bit I have found, from personal experience, that most of the Jehovah’s Witnesses are actually good people but are unfortunately brainwashed by the religion; and as family and friends are all in the religion people find it very hard to leave; knowing they will be shunned and treated as outcasts by both family and friends.

    The Watchtower Society employ the classic ‘divide and conquer’ strategy to ensure that those with questions and doubts cannot ‘infect’ the specific doctrine they peddle.

    Be strong, if for nothing more than one day your wife may realize the truth and need you.

  • May 6, 2014 at 8:09 am
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    Only just realising,

    I am so sorry for you. This is the real face of this so called Christian religion! To allege that God will kill your child is unforgivable. There is no biblical support for such a hurtful statement.

    In my experience, poeple lash out like that when their own feelings are called into question. Instead of contemplating their fears calmly, they try to offload their own fears onto others.

    If you have need of Christian comfort, may I suggest that you look at JW Struggle, a sister site of this one? There is a link to their page on the main page of this site.

    The main thing to keep in mind, if you still believe in God, is that ANY human being’s opinion of your relationship with God is irrelevant. You have a personal relationship with God, and that is in no way affected by leaving the Jehovah’s Witnesses religion. Jesus still died for you and your child, too. You are still in a state of Grace, because nothing can separate you from God’s love.

    I hope that these words bring you comfort in your time of need.

    Peace be with you

    Excelsior!

  • May 6, 2014 at 8:17 am
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    Zeebo,

    I can certainly relate to your feelings. In a way, you are right. If people choose to follow those seven men, then it’s their fault.

    However, no one that I know joined this religion to follow seven men. They joined a cult that lied to them. They continue to live in a cult that controls their thoughts and feelings.

    I was once a “true believer”. I did not question the diktats of that nebulous slave until I began to read other books and began to listen to my conscience.

    I remember finding out about Episode 1 of Star Wars in the early 90s, and thinking that it was a shame that I would never get to see it, as Armageddon would have come before it could be shot and released!!! I really believed that then.

    Now, I am a post graduate level educated man, with a far better outlook on life. I did not have access to any of the information on this site. I did not have an internet community to help me through.

    My point is that we were all idiots at one time!

    In my opinion, we should treat those still trapped with compassion and realise that we were once like them, trapped in a cult with no access to reality.

    Peace be with you

    Excelsior!

  • May 6, 2014 at 8:31 am
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    Thanks for this article Cedars. I sure hope that the public at large, judicial systems, and other government agencies become aware of the true nature of the truuuuth. Then they will see it for what it is. One of the most repressive, harmful, and dangerous religious cults under the guise of charity. The Watchtower does not build hospitals, orphanages, soup kitchens, schools…zip, zilch, nada yet them claim charitable status. They don’t even do this for their own members – Witnesses are left to pick up their own tab. If Witnesses could only realize it’s their own power that gets them results and not “Jehovah’s Organization” they’d be much better off. Go Finland!

  • May 6, 2014 at 8:35 am
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    I think that instead of wasting precious time talking about this denomination people should work together and make their rights be properly heard.
    The fact that a person by conscience leaves the organisation without creating any divisions is shunned by loved friends and family members is unjust and should not be tolerated. The corporation has an army of lawyers, we know that if you have money you can win almost any case. So I think ex cult members should unite, put resources together, create a strong legal team and fight for the basic right to be religiously free. A right that the corporation wants but denies to others.

  • May 6, 2014 at 9:04 am
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    In recent decades, another negative development has taken root within the organization that is linked to this. Shunning has been expanded to include children, unbaptized associates, persons with accents or mental diseases, non-participants in stage-presentations, and so on.

    It will be great when Finland looks into this and challenges the religious right to dehumanize a state’s citizens.  Many JWs will see this as so-called persecution, but some will be forced to reconsider whether what they are doing is really what ‘God wants.’

  • May 6, 2014 at 9:22 am
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    Thank you so much for your response Excelsior!

    Your kind words were so needed.

    I’m a lot calmer now, I’ve been reading other’s experiences on JW Struggle, and taking much comfort from that.

    A prayer for me and family also helped me to gain perspective on what brought me to my decision.

    The pain isn’t easy by no means, but I just look at my son and know I’ve chosen freedom for him. I would do anything to keep him safe, this I will survive.

    Thank you

  • May 6, 2014 at 11:11 am
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    But they speak English, I’m sure of that.

  • May 6, 2014 at 12:54 pm
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    I’m not really scared of people telling everyone to shun their friends and family. But I’m really scared of people who actually follow such instructions …

  • May 6, 2014 at 1:03 pm
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    U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals:

    “Although we recognize that the harms suffered by [the disfellowshipped person] are real and not insubstantial, permitting her to recover for intangible or emotional injuries would unconstitutionally restrict the Jehovah’s Witnesses free exercise of religion… The constitutional guarantee of the free exercise of religion requires that society tolerate the type of harms suffered by [the disfellowshipped person] as a price well worth paying to safeguard the right of religious difference that all citizens enjoy.”

    • May 6, 2014 at 1:13 pm
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      Oh, they will make Al Quaida jealous :-)

  • May 6, 2014 at 2:57 pm
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    @Oubliette

    You can contact them in English. What with English being the international language of commerce and business, and the Finnish education system being superb, they will obviously understand you.

    Your remark sounds a bit flippant, that’s all.

  • May 6, 2014 at 3:44 pm
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    Just curious Defender. Was that before or after Waco and the Branch Dividians and was it before or after Jim Jones and People’s Temple in Guyana. Was it before or after Warren Jeffs who raped all those little girls in the name of religion? As I recall, Jeffs is in jail. Just because we have freedom of religion in the U.S. doesn’t make every practice of a religion legal. Sometimes the government will step in if the religion proves harmful to it’s followers. I think the article you are bringing up is something for a bad religion to hide behind.

    None of us have a problem disfellowshipping someone who actually could cause harm to the congregation. As a matter of fact, we wished the Watchtower would do that, say to child abusers, who they protect, but the abused is told to “shut up or put up” unless they can get a 2nd witnesses to the abuse. No one is ever told they can go to the authorities. The Watchtower might put that in magazines for the public but we all know who have ever been in that position that we were discouraged from reporting it to the authorities so that we didn’t “bring reproach on Jehovah’s name” and were told that we’d be the one who could face disfellowshipping for going to the authorities. So, the abused has to go to meetings and see his abuser or quit going to meetings. At least the Catholic church shipped the abusive priests to other churches and at least they are paying money for their covering up the abuse. The Watchtower didn’t even do that for those poor children. They had to see their abusers being treated good. Isn’t Jehovah all powerful, Wise and Just? What is JUST about an organization that protects child molesters? The Watchtower is mocking Jehovah when they claim to be His Organization with such evil practices. They protect molesters and shun the molested if they dare to speak up in order to protect the congregation.

    This website that Cedars is spending his hard earned money on, is called: Giving a Voice to the Silent Majority. When we were baptized, we thought we were pledging our allegiance to a God-ordained and loving organization but it ended up being an open-ended contract on the side of the Watchtower Society. We said yes to those 2 questions and were baptized into what we thought was a Godly and loving Organization but the Organization can change the rules at any moment and we are supposed to support those changes and rules no matter whether those rules are Biblical or not. We were never given a vote on anything. Nobody told any of us about this open-ended contract when we were baptized. We found out about it after we were baptized and have no way of cancelling that contract except to disassociate ourselves and be shunned. The only one that can cancel the contract is the Watchtower Society and we have no say in the matter.

    We would love for anyone to actually defend the Watchtower so that we don’t feel as though our lives were wasted on a false religion. It says Cedar’s website that if you can find any mistakes to let him know. According to Revelation, liars will be thrown into the lake of fire. Almighty God would never condone a religion in his name that told lies in his name. Please tell us we were wrong about the Society lying to us. Every minute of every hour of every day, I regret ever getting involved in this religion and that has been my thought for 48 years now. Please prove us wrong. We’d love to hear you prove us wrong.

    You seem to think that all of Jehovah’s Witnesses were given a choice to uphold every disfellowshipping. The last time I was at a meeting, I don’t remember ever being asked my opinion and in fact, I would probably be disfellowshipped if I disagreed with the policy.

    How many of us would have gotten baptized into this religion if we only knew then what we know now? I bet nobody would be that stupid if we knew all the facts before getting dunked.

    Please prove us wrong.

    • May 6, 2014 at 4:13 pm
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      Defender has failed, of course, to defend that indefensible little cult.

      Should he post again, no doubt the tradition of failure will be maintained.

  • May 6, 2014 at 6:50 pm
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    Hah, vindicated by one of the World’s most crooked court systems.

    “All things are lawful, but not all things are profitable. All things are lawful, but not all things edify.”

  • May 6, 2014 at 11:50 pm
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    Defender
    that Jesus has appointed 7 men in US as the faithful slave is one of the biggest lies ever said. Yes, you might win all court cases but for sure you will not win God approval. Unfortunately power, prestige and control and bigger values then love for some people. Fortunately the internet is proving a valid tool for preventing cults making more victims and making the end of cults closer.

  • May 7, 2014 at 1:23 am
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    My point in posting above was not to argue doctrines. It was solely to provide an objective counterpoint to a *specific* idea that some here seem to promote. Namely, that the government should take action to restrict the practice of certain religions. As the non-witness high judges say in the above opinions, freedom of religious belief and expression are not things to be lightly tossed aside.

    There are many, many beliefs I find offensive and even emotionally hurtful that I would defend the free expression of, because defending each person’s right to be free from government censorship is the only way I can defend my right to be so free.

    To your point, if an Al-Qaida member was actively assisting an act of terrorism or physical violence, then they would be criminally responsible. However, merely preaching offensive things should not, and in most civilized societies does not, subject one to criminal liability. I posted the above court finding to show that a panel of trained legal officials have reviewed Jehovah’s Witnesses specifically at very high levels and found that the practice of choosing who to associate with via shunning/excommunication/disfellowshipping must be protected Constitutionally. Obviously many panels of the ECHR and other very learned jurists have come to the same conclusion. Consider that this may be because they are aware of the slippery slope toward totalitarianism that begins when religious behavior is proscribed by government in any but the most extreme cases (e.g. direct active incitement of physical violence).

    As a side point, and I say this knowing it will make me seem less reliable in your eyes, Ironically, as many of you are aware, Jehovah’s Witnesses do believe that the governments of the world will eventually turn on religion, much as you are advocating here. However, this will be due to God’s purpose for the conclusion of wickedness and the removal of disobedient ones.

    • May 7, 2014 at 1:43 am
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      Incitement to violence, as in holding up placards declaring ‘Behead those who insult the Prophet’ has resulted in criminal proceedings in England, as does any incitement to violence.

      Regarding the freedom to promote shunning, from the rostrums of Kingdom Halls and the printing presses of New York, I understand your point, Defender.

      It may be that the answer lies, not in legislation, but in education. It does not take much extra – WT study, to realise that the claims of the WT bosses are utterly bogus, and the basis of their authority a total sham.

      Democracy requires that we are all subject to the same legal systems. In the UK we still have ecclesiastical and military law. Non church members and civilians, however, can be subject to these laws when on church or military property.

      Some synagogues and mosques, esp. in marital disputes, have tried to subvert the laws of England and Wales through sessions of their own ‘Beth Din’ and Sharia courts. That is a cause for concern, as indeed are the JW judicial committees

    • May 7, 2014 at 4:30 am
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      In the part of the world where I leave statements that offense a part of the population, even without any further physical attack, is a crime as well.

      My point is, if the judge admits that the religious practice results in harm upon people (no matter what the extent of it is) he’s allowing injustice to happen. He’s not protecting the weak.

      If on the other hand, a disassociated person constantly shows up in meetings just for causing trouble and offend the witnesses, even verbally, it would also give the congregation the right to sue such a person in order to continue enjoying their religious freedom.

      What is really happening is, the congregation punishes the person who wanted to leave, and reminds that “they will have a price to pay for it”. No matter what that price is, it’s not right.

      Unlike many others who commented, I’m not taking the existing laws as the basis. I don’t trust them neither. Many laws are used to protect wrongdoers and they get twisted in a way to use the gaps, where eventually the weak gets punished.

      My basis is the conscience. Because you decide you don’t believe in something anymore, and maybe you decide to follow a different way of life … And for this, you go through humiliation, phychologic pressure and deprivation of your friends and family. How would that make you feel ?

      How can you view a group of people doing that on a person as God and human loving people ? The true worshippers of God of love ? The ones who treat others the way they would like to be treated ?

      Just leave all these laws and rules aside … What does your reason tell you ? … That’s my guideline, no governing body is above it.

  • May 7, 2014 at 1:53 am
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    Personally I think that if a child get baptised at 12 and at 30 does no longer agree with human interpretations and ideas should not loose the relationship with loved ones. This is against freedom. This is specially wrong when a religion attracts people by hiding past bizarre teaching like pyramidology, false date, etc.
    I believe Defender that God will turn against organisations that think have the monopoly of salvation and put themselves above God. The reality is that although the organisation is doing a huge marketing campaign the results are scarce. People know today that the organisation pollute Bible teaching with nonsense and clever invented stories. Time will tell, after all generations cannot overlap forever.

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