Judge intervenes to grant blood transfusion for boy despite parents’ “devout beliefs”

high-court-bloodOn Monday a number of UK newspapers reported that the son of two devout Jehovah’s Witnesses WILL be given a blood transfusion if he needs it, following a ruling by a high court judge.

Doctors told Mr Justice Moylan that the “very young” boy was suffering from severe burns following an accident, and might need a blood transfusion.

The ruling was requested by a health trust with responsibility for treating the boy, and was granted after the judge concluded that a transfusion would be in the youngster’s best interests irrespective of the “deeply held views” of his Witness parents.

The child’s name and age have not been released.

In delivering his ruling, Moylan expressed his hopes that the boy’s parents would understand.

“I am extremely grateful to [the boy’s] father for so clearly and calmly explaining to me the position held by himself and [the boy’s] mother,” he said. “I have no doubt at all that they love their son dearly. I also have no doubt that they object to the receipt by [their son] of a blood transfusion because of their devout beliefs. I hope they will understand why I have reached the decision which I have, governed as it is [their son’s] welfare.”

Though controversial, this type of ruling, as recently fictionalized in Ian McEwan’s best-selling novel “The Children Act,” is quite commonplace.

Earlier this year another high court judge, Mr Justice Keehan, ordered that surgeons at the Birmingham Children’s Hospital could administer blood to a baby irrespective of his parents’ religious views. And there have been similar reported cases in Australia and New Zealand.

The dangers posed by arbitrarily insisting through religious dogma what types of medical treatment should be accepted or declined were recently highlighted in the tragic case of Adeline Keh, who died earlier this year after refusing blood following a C-section.

 

new-cedars-signature2

 

 

 

 

 

 

Further reading…

83 thoughts on “Judge intervenes to grant blood transfusion for boy despite parents’ “devout beliefs”

  • December 11, 2014 at 1:17 am
    Permalink

    I’ve donated 10 gallons over the years, I have you covered. Actually the thought did go through my mind on many ocassions that just maybe a JW who had heart surgery or was involved in an accident losing a greater deal of blood, might benefit from mine.

  • December 11, 2014 at 1:39 am
    Permalink

    Don’t touch Jehovah’s Testicles!!
    – Lev3:16-17 NWT v8.1 comming soon!

  • December 11, 2014 at 3:38 am
    Permalink

    And alltheapostatesmustdie, the couple in question have not sinned. The decision was taken out of their hands. The decision was never theirs to make in reality. As regards the stain of sin, are you sinless?
    What makes you believe that you are righteous enough to make that judgement, do you speak for God and can arbitrarily pass sentence as a sinner. . . Interesting control and MORAL judgement. You are owned.

  • December 11, 2014 at 7:08 am
    Permalink

    Apostates will face certain judgement,

    Your comments have upset me greatly. Who are you referring to in your first comment? Is it the little child, or its parents? Your comment is not clear.

    I am more than happy to face JESUS CHRIST on the day of Judgement. I shall have freedom of speech because I have done my best to love and show compassion.

    Your fear of God denies your love of God. Love casts fear outside. 1 John 4: 16 – 19

    I wonder why you have bothered to comment on this apostate site? Your governing body has decreed that you should not be looking at these sites, have they not?

    I urge you to research independently your religion. The truth shall set you free.

    Peace be with you,

    Excelsior!

  • December 11, 2014 at 8:15 am
    Permalink

    @Apostates will face judgement, It’s lovely to hear from you,
    I’m so glad you don’t agree with the censorship placed on the
    rest of your brother and sister J,Ws, regarding visits to
    “Apostate” sites.

    Isn’t it wonderful to enjoy the free will that God gave you,
    I’m sure you’ll agree that censorship is mainly used by
    controlling regimes who fear being exposed, and losing their
    power. The Truth will stand up to any examination, and will
    even be stronger for it.

    I look forward to future comments from you, and it would go
    a long way to prove you are not under control, If you would
    use your real name.

    Please forgive me but your “Nom de plume” sounds rather
    Self Righteous, and I’m sure you know, that the self righteous
    have more to fear from judgement than anyone else.

  • December 11, 2014 at 9:29 am
    Permalink

    Apostates will face certain judgement…
    It is obvious from your time spent responding to comments on this site, that loyalty to “jehovahs visible organisation” is not high on your list of priorities.
    If and I say “if”, you truly with a complete heart believe that the watchtower society is being directed by jehovah and christ jesus, then you should strictly have no dealings with this or any other site that has not been approved by jw.org.
    By debating with individuals who have chosen to take a sabbatical , quietly leave, been disfellowshipped or are at a crossroads in their spiritual lives is Not the direction given by the watchtower society.
    I like many who now look at this site loyally obeyed the directive to turn away from so called “apostate sites”..for 26 years.
    I do not waste time looking at every negative site and neither do I believe everything I read…I try to have a balanced view of all things in life and respect the views of others , though I may not agree with them.
    I am not judging you or anyone else who frequents this site, but by engaging yourself in conversations through this forum has proven to the ones who read your comments that you cant really believe and accept all the direction from the faithful and discreet slave …now can you?
    May I politely suggest your time be better spent in field service helping someone more in need? than ones who have no need of help…must go…dogs need feeding…forgive the sarcasm…its my humour..ttfn

  • December 11, 2014 at 10:10 am
    Permalink

    Most people taking chemotherapy eventually need blood. My mother in law needed 23 blood transfusions over the course of her Chemo, because it destroys your red cells too.

    So I think most JWs take blood secretly and just lie about it. Otherwise, we would see an epidemic of dead JWs and the world would take notice of that.

  • December 11, 2014 at 10:11 am
    Permalink

    Most people taking chemotherapy eventually need blood. My mother in law needed 23 blood transfusions over the course of her Chemo, because it destroys your red cells too.

    So I think most JWs take blood secretly. Otherwise, we would see an epidemic of dead JWs and the world would take notice of that.

  • December 11, 2014 at 10:15 am
    Permalink

    Has anyone got a copy of the May 22nd 1994 awake. If so could you tell me if the children on the front cover died for their faith. I am hoping this article is just saying they took a stand and survived. Appreciate anyone looking this up for me please.

  • December 11, 2014 at 10:26 am
    Permalink

    @ Apostates Will Face Certain Judgment says:

    Ohhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

  • December 11, 2014 at 11:00 am
    Permalink

    I have found the answer to my question. My alias “Feelingsicktomystomach” doesn’t begin to cover it.

  • December 11, 2014 at 11:48 am
    Permalink

    @gary. “Fractions of a Nazi. Salute” in the Synagogue
    had me in stitches…So that’s how the German squaddies
    did it, “By Fractions”, very precise!.
    It was a lot easier when I did my National Service. LOL.

  • December 11, 2014 at 12:42 pm
    Permalink

    Now the question, using that analogy, in my mind would be. . why would the leaders of the Jewish faith want to have factions of a Nazi salute anyway?
    Thanks for the reply.x

  • December 11, 2014 at 12:49 pm
    Permalink

    This is a topic that will doubtless receive full attention by that well known blood expert and eminent cleaning company owner, Mr Latham.

    Just as Mr Cedars is a world renowned expert on matters of undue influence concerning the WBTS, Mr Latham is likewise unparralled when it comes to the issue of blood transfusion.

    Whilst Mr Latham may not be in full agreement with Mr Cedars on the matter of lively protesting, I have an unquestionable faith that these two intellectuals (Mr Latham reads the Guardian btw) will both be fully supportive of each other’s efforts in highlighting this most contentious matter. We can be certain there will be no grandstanding amongst these two giants of the alternative perspective.

    To borrow a phrase from Stephen Jay Gould, we are dealing with a case of non-overlapping magisteria when it comes to their respective disciplines.

  • December 11, 2014 at 12:59 pm
    Permalink

    If a person due to whatever they believe choses a course of action which may endanger their life, whatever they believe, they are free to do so.
    I respect that and admire that hugely. I, knowing that you were of sound mind would stand by you all the way.
    However if that belief is enforced on another I have to disagree, especially when it’s a child.
    If you bow to a certain belief you don’t need a stick over you to make sure.

  • December 11, 2014 at 1:02 pm
    Permalink

    I did tell my wife she could have a piece of my chocolate cake but I didn’t tell her how many fractions she could have.

  • December 11, 2014 at 1:06 pm
    Permalink

    She can have what she wants.. . .:-) yes love, I will wash the dishes.x

  • December 11, 2014 at 1:22 pm
    Permalink

    Your doomed to destruction love. You eat 3/4
    Put that in your moral pie.

  • December 11, 2014 at 4:09 pm
    Permalink

    What a person is a person will here.

  • December 11, 2014 at 7:19 pm
    Permalink

    So we already know the jw’s are insane…everyone knows the definition of insanity, riiiiight? riiiiiight…ok good, moving along…

    The issue im having with this whole little irrelevant scenario, is the fact that government can decide what we do and don’t do with our own spawn lol. The human race has gotten so far off course, that we now allow other humans make decisions for us…as if they are any wiser than the next, and knows all regarding the best decision to be made. The simple fact that government can control what you do with your own children is disturbing in itself. Schools are now sending home letters with children to tell their parents when they should schedule a dentist appointment lol…and also allows your child to use whichever restroom they would like (male or female) in the name of equality. They decide what your child will even eat at school…unless you are being proactive and sending your child prepared with what you have personally approved of, but of course most parents are too lazy to even do that…so they let government decide for them.

    Forget the pathetic monstrous governing body lol…ppl we have GOVERNMENT that has the gb beat by a long shot…in fact, gov is the gb’s mentor lol.

  • December 12, 2014 at 6:47 am
    Permalink

    Congrats!,

    Would you deny that there are certain circumstances when “The Government” should intervene?

    Remember, this government has been voted for by the majority of voters and has a mandate to govern, hence its name the government.

    I do not share your view that “the Government” has any role in mentoring the gb. And no, I’m not laughing out loud.

    I do not have an issue with healthy eating being encouraged in schools. I am a teacher, and I resent the implication that I am in some way interfering with a parent’s right to feed their children. Should a parent be allowed to feed their child inappropriate food with no sanction, just because they are the parent? What nonsense!

    There are legitimate circumstances when the State has to intervene in the relationship between a parent and their child(ren). It is part of our responsibility in our society that we care for all the children in our society.

    I’m afraid that your opinion in this matter is very far from most people.

    Would you care to rephrase or qualify your comment?

    Peace be with you

    Excelsior!

  • December 12, 2014 at 4:59 pm
    Permalink

    This is a topic that will doubtless receive the fullest attention of that well known blood expert and eminent cleaning company owner, Mr Latham.

    Just as Mr Cedars is a world renowned expert on matters of undue influence, Mr Latham is likewise an international authority when it comes to the issue of blood transfusion.

    Whilst Mr Latham may not be in full agreement with Mr Cedars on the matter of lively protesting, I have an unquestionable faith that these two intellectuals (Mr Latham reads the Guardian btw) will be fully supportive of each other’s efforts in highlighting this most contentious matter. We can be certain that there will be no grandstanding between these two giants of the alternative perspective.

    To borrow a phrase from the late Stephen Jay Gould, we are dealing with a case of non-overlapping magisteria when it comes to their respective disciplines.

  • December 12, 2014 at 6:25 pm
    Permalink

    Meman,

    Though I sympathise with your emotional reaction to “apostates will…”‘s comment, I would urge you to show restraint in the choice of language that you choose to express your contempt.

    This kind of vitriol will not change anyone’s opinion and is in vivid contrast to the tone of the previous comments.

    I hope that we can all work together to help the victims of the cruel cult known as the WTBTS.

    Peace be with you,

    Excelsior!

  • December 12, 2014 at 10:25 pm
    Permalink

    @ Charlie Wrangle . Like The GOVERNING BODY are World Renowned experts on VACCINATIONS,BLOOD FRACTIONS (Thank God for WORLDLY PEOPLE who Donate Blood so JWs can have blood fractions) .The Governing Body are Renowned experts on Flip Flopping The Generation Teaching,Sheep&Goats,Faithful Slave,Higher Powers,Recently Wise& Foolish Virgins(I love a Foolish Virgin) ,Gog & Magog,etc,etc Oh THE SO WISE GOVERNING BODY.Oh by the way there are no GREEK WORDs for Governing Body in the New Testament.A MAN MADE LEGAL ENTITY!!!!!

  • December 12, 2014 at 10:37 pm
    Permalink

    ANY LOYAL ??? JEHOVAHS WITNESS should not be Commenting on this site in a derogatory way as you are going against the wishes of The Governing Body as they tell us not to mix with Apostate sites like this one!!!If you associate with foolish people you will fare badly as Proverbs States.So any NAUGHTY NAUGHTY JWs who are not Allowed Freedom of Thought or Expression unless you Totally parrot or agree with The Governing Body on Everything & if you dare to disagree with any doctrine & VOICED it in the WATCHTOWER STudy you would be spoken to by The Elders in The Backroom.Believe me it’s happened to me .THOUGHT CONTROL.1984 by George Orwell

  • December 13, 2014 at 11:28 pm
    Permalink

    there is no need to qualify or rephrase my comment…and I can careless how many ppl do or does not agree with it LOL. I meant exactly what I said, the human race has gotten so far off course that most of them need an/other human(s) to guide or tell them what to do. its the human race that has abused simple logic to a point where “government” has to step in and save a child from child abuse…because the mother/father is that mentally ill in some sort of way, where they cant control themselves to not be abusive o_o. because the human race is as fickle and ass backwards as it was and continues to become, government was put into place to “help” the poor pathetic poorly thinking creatures. now that very government (worldwide) is using the “help” against the human race to enslave them.

    yes government is the gb’s mentor…how else do you learn how to keep a slew of brains under a false, ludicrous sense of protection and morale?? how else do you learn to bamboozle the very ppl that trust you and live their lives according to your “laws and suggestions” no matter how asinine they are or become?? how else do you take free willed human beings, and convince them to be ok with being blatently used to your advantage?? ill wait…

  • December 13, 2014 at 11:36 pm
    Permalink

    and honestly, I was just kidding about the gov being the gb’s mentor in my first comment…but its amazing how easy it was to equate the two together once I began typing lol…so maybe it shouldn’t have been a joke afterall, cause it sure sounds like the truth to me :-P

  • December 14, 2014 at 6:42 am
    Permalink

    congrats,

    I ask again, do you think there are any circumstances when “the Government” should intervene?

    Was this case an example of when the Courts, which are independent of “the Government”, were right to intervene?

    Peace be with you,

    Excelsior!

  • December 14, 2014 at 8:24 am
    Permalink

    So, what are you doing reading / commenting on an ‘apostate’ website?

  • December 14, 2014 at 12:42 pm
    Permalink

    because of the incompetent nature of most human beings these days, sadly and unfortunately they need others to guide or instruct them on decent behavior and how to live decent lives…looks like gov is the source majority of ppl run to. that doesn’t make gov a good or positive entity (as their potent track record has exposed), it just gives them an easier upperhand on controlling the non or shallow dependent thinkers. courts could not even exist without gov, and if you are still believing that they are separate by any means, then you haven’t pulled back the curtain of deceit and taken a gander yet. no manmade entity has been fit to judge or rule over another, but yet ppl willfully yield their free will over to them for the sake of so called safety and security.

    that dependent lazy thinking has been ingrained deeper and deeper generation after generation…together we will see how well that is going to fair in the end, since majority are still blinded from seeing it now.

    since I can already tell you need a black and white, yes or no answer to your question “do you think there are any circumstances when “the Government” should intervene?”, ill give it to you…NO, I do not believe there are ANY circumstances where gov of any sort should intervene in the lives and situations of capable human beings who are not yet mentally braindead and dependent upon someone to dictate ANYthing to them. I on the otherhand don’t speak for the dependent thinkers, because I am no longer one of them…but because there are a saturation of them, most ppl have been convinced that gov is the only thing available to protect them and others (although they have proven otherwise).

    an adult human being that desires other adult human beings to be in control of another human beings life and/or decisions…exposes their incompetent and dependent thinking.

    let me ask you this…when did the shift happen, where gov stopped working for the ppl, and the ppl began working for it??

  • December 14, 2014 at 1:21 pm
    Permalink

    @congrats!!

    Quoting from your first post: “The issue im having with this whole little irrelevant scenario, is the fact that government can decide what we do and don’t do with our own spawn lol.”

    First of all, saving the life of a defenseless child who is completely dependent on it’s parents to do everything in their power to save his life and the parents’ being misled and under mind control of a destructive cult is not irrelevant and that child when he grows up, will be eternally grateful to the government for “stepping” in to save his life. It is so easy for you to say it’s “irrelevant” when it’s not your life on the line or your child’s life, isn’t it? I wonder how it would be for you, if it was you facing this situation and you knew that if you refused blood, that the next 15 minutes of life, would be it for you and you would be forever dead, never to experience another day????? Would this still seem like an irrelevant discussion if it was your life we were talking about???

    Secondly, you refer to a child as being “spawn”. Just because we can give birth to our children, doesn’t give us the right to refer to them as our “spawn”. They are a living, human being with rights. That child has just as many “rights” as any adult. They aren’t “spawn”. They are children, not fish.

    To keep going on and on like you do about the government having to step in for people who are brain dead, is not irrelevant. Sometimes, a government has to step in when a cult has taken control over the parent’s sense of right and wrong. You can bemoan the government all you want, and it is irrelevant but not when it comes to the saving of a child’s life.

  • December 14, 2014 at 3:51 pm
    Permalink

    hmmm…how would I feel if I were in that position? I don’t know, never been in it before. but I DO know that it is an intricate subject because there are so many levels to it…such as there are many other options to “save a life” besides injecting them with someone elses blood o_o. you guys have become so dependent on gov and who they allow to “practice medicine and life saving techniques”, that in your mind what they say can over rule what a capable parent may feel is best. is the only reason you are siding with gov/courts in this situation is because it is a jw parent…but what if it were a “worldly” parent? would you still say the gov is protecting the child from “mind controlled” parents?? i know plenty of parents who abstain from vaccines, fluoridated water, gmo food, indoctrinating public school systems, pharmaceuticals, and non holistic doctors…and guess what, not one of them are a jw and never has been…they are only capable independent thinking adults who has educated themselves on their surroundings and what it takes to survive them. but you know who supports and creates all those things those parents chose to abstain from?? their government does.

    when i said “spawn”, i used it as a figure of speech that many ppl are familiar with besides speaking of fish…if you are sensitive to that, it is of no concern of mine…and i would advise you to find more concerning things to be sensitive about.

    i didn’t say the fact that the gov has to step in for dependent thinkers is irrelevant…i said this scenario of yet another jw refusing blood for themselves or their children and it being forced upon them is irrelevant…they are one in many. the true relevance is the fact that we are surrounded by dependent thinkers that has been convinced they need gov to “help” them along this life journey.

    if you are going to take in and consider what i say, please take nothing out of context…that is something a dependent thinker is prone to do so that it suffices with what they would prefer instead of what is logical…and by your oh so sincere reply, i would hardly like to think that you are a dependent thinker -_-.

  • December 14, 2014 at 4:22 pm
    Permalink

    @congrats!!

    I am curious. Are you one of Jehovah’s Witnesses? The reason I am asking is because Jehovah’s Witnesses are made up wholly of “dependent” thinkers. That is the whole point of this discussion. If Jehovah’s Witnesses were “independent” thinkers, they would be allowed to read about the pros and cons of blood transfusions and make up their own minds as to whether or not to allow it for themselves or their children, but the Watchtower Society has taken that “independent” thinking away from them on the threat of disfellowshipping if they don’t go along with what the Governing Body has decided this week.

    Next week, they could change their mind completely and this organization would have to go along with anything and everything that they have decided upon even if that means that they would have to let their child die because the only way that child would live very well could be because he or she needs blood.

    We are not disputing that there are other ways sometimes when a blood transfusion is not essential. We are only referring to a case where the person will die without it. If you are disputing that little children have died for want of a blood transfusion, I’d invite you to look at the May 22 Awake magazine where the Watchtower brags about all the children who died because they didn’t take blood.

    Are you disputing that the Watchtower organization is a mild-controlling cult???? Do you believe that people can fall under the spell of a mind-controlling cult???

    Here in the U.S. there is a religion called Christian Science and there have been plenty of cases where parents refused medical treatment for their children and the children have died and the parents have been held responsible for their deaths and the parents are in prison for not taking care of their child in the name of religion. Just because you have birthed “spawn”, doesn’t give you or anybody the right to treat these “spawn” as if they “belong” to you. You are only their caretakers. You don’t have the right to do anything you think you want to with them. Those were the dark ages. Thank goodness that there are laws in place to protect the rights of children over people who think they “own” their children.

    You can be against Government all you want but that discussion is irrelevant to this discussion but only when it comes to people in government stepping in and saving the life of a child whose parents have fallen under the spell of a mind-controlling cult and the parents don’t have the good sense to be “independent” thinkers and think outside the box of the Watchtower group think and make wise decisions.

    You need to understand how mind-controlled cults work to take part in this discussion. We who comment on this topic either were Jehovah’s Witnesses for many years or are ex-Jehovah’s Witnesses and we know what we are talking about.

    This isn’t about taking what you are saying out of context. We aren’t all that interested in how the governments in different countries control how people raise their kids, except for when the parents are too indoctrinated by their religion to make wise choices.

    When it comes to people not taking vaccines or not eating gmo’s or flouride, that has nothing to do with this discussion and none of those decisions are life-threatening.

  • December 14, 2014 at 5:22 pm
    Permalink

    taking blood has its life threatening dangers, some so severe if you were faced with the decision and had to sign a discrepancy saying you accept all the possible side affects, you would think twice as well. I have been in that situation, and I opted out of it for various reasons. but the number one reason was that I didn’t want my immune system lowered to barely functioning while it was trying to intergrate someone elses dna within my body systems. if it turns out for the worse, then you will be worst off than you were before…I personally didn’t want to take that chance. I did diligent productive research, and found a healthy natural alternative…and have been top notch in health ever since. jw’s do not abstain from blood because of the major life threatening risks of it (although before they were able to accept portions of it, that was their next best excuse), but more so because of their severe brainwashing. if I had a child, I would not want someone to force something upon us, and we are left to deal with the potentially unwanted consequences. I mentioned vaccines and whatnot because they are as harmful to your body as all other poisonings, if not worse…and they have long term effects that WILL last a lifetime. if the gov are the ones who instituted mandatory vaccines and allowed gmo’s etc, what does that tell you about the very gov you are giving props for supposedly “saving a childs life”?? epic contradiction comes to mind. how are they truly interested in saving lives, when they mandate that lives be threatened and compromised the moment they are brought into existence???

    you have not looked behind the curtain of deceit either it seems.

    I understand the jw’s are mind controlled dependent zombies…but there is still the rest of the world out there…and sometimes its not only the jw’s who are being mind controlled, and its not always a religious cult doing the controlling…sometimes its ok to pull the microscope back a little bit and notice more detail of the actual problem…that’s the only way it will ever come close to getting solved.

  • December 14, 2014 at 5:44 pm
    Permalink

    @congrats!!

    I was one of Jehovah’s Witnesses from 1964 until just this year and I went through the blood booklet and remember it well and I know all the pros and cons of taking blood. Two times, my youngest daughter would have died without blood, fractions the first time and the 2nd time platelets.

    I remember a man in the hospital when my husband was a patient, and the doctors were giving him blood because he had a bleeding ulcer so I am well aware of how freely, doctors think blood is necessary when many times, it is not necessary and iron pills would do the trick.

    We are only talking about cases where the patient will die without it, not maybe’s.

    When it comes to mind control cults, you have to realize that just because we had children born to us, that we are not free to withhold treatment just because we decide that is in the best interest of the child when that child will die without treatment and just because 7 men in New York said we can’t give blood to our child. There is no support for the theory that God would kill us at Armageddon if we took blood. We have to remember that Jesus gave the illustration that it was lawful to work on the Sabbath to save the life of an animal and our children are worth more than an animal. If you remember, working on the Sabbath was a death sentence according to the Mosaic law covenant. Jesus set the example that a human life is the most important thing, not the breaking of man-made rules that are not supported in the Bible anyway.

    That little child is completely dependent on parents or somebody with a half a brain in their heads, to take care of them.

    A very young child doesn’t have a choice in the matter. If the parents are morons and don’t have the good sense to watch over their child in a responsible manner, then sometimes, that is what government is for. These parents would have to be dumber than animals because most animal mothers will defend to the death to take care of their “spawn”. If they don’t have the good sense that even animal mothers have, then obviously that mother and father aren’t in their right minds and thankfully there is somebody around who will step in and take care of that helpless child.

    We are not talking about a government taking away children from their parents like what Hitler did. We are talking about responsible people who are willing to step in when parents are morons or under the spell of a cult who has no qualms about sacrificing babies on the Watchtower alter.

    When it comes to Witnesses who are willing to sacrifice the life of their child to 7 men in New York who are no smarter or gifted when it comes to understanding the Bible, then those parents are not in their right minds and that child needs to have an advocate to fight for it.

    To suggest that all government is bad is to have chaos and nonsensical.

  • December 14, 2014 at 7:39 pm
    Permalink

    well for some reason my last comment didn’t show up…but im kind of glad it didn’t because I have realized something.

    you mentioned you recently disconnected from one of the most influential religious cults known to man, after 50yrs of being plugged in…you more than likely have lots of things to shake off and even more to learn about the world and how it is functioning around you. the jw clan is just another sect of bamboozlement that the gov has in its back pocket…each and every gov even answers to higher authority…none of which has anybodys best interest at heart.

    once you actually pull back that curtain, and examine the scene behind it, you will see a lot of things differently than you may see them now…and I truly wish wisdom and brain defrostment your way, as I do my own mother and family members that have been caught up in this blinding monstrous sect for way too many decades.

    I will leave this conversation with mercy and understanding of your plight. in the words of Excelsior!, peace be with you.

  • December 15, 2014 at 1:17 am
    Permalink

    @contrats!!. I understand that you have people who are caught up in this religion and so I see your plight.

    I also realize that the world is made up of religions like the JW’s also, but the JW’s are among the most destructive. I am not blind to that fact.

    People seem to need religion and if they didn’t need it before a JW comes knocking on their door, if they open their home to a “Bible” study with a JW, that JW, will soon make that person feel the need for religion.

    Religion is the opium of the people and it fills the need of people and most people are fooled by it. I know that.

    Most JW’s know that too, but they, like the rest of the world, think the only ones fooled are the “others”. That is the way it works, world wide and religion is at the core of it.

    Government works hand in hand with religion and religion works hand in hand with government. They are symbiotic. My eyes have been wide open to this fact for some time, but like the rest of the world, I didn’t think it applied to my religion, until I also “woke” up to it.

    I also wish you peace.

  • December 15, 2014 at 9:12 am
    Permalink

    No government is perfect, we all like to have a go at them,
    But what’s the alternative,?– Anarchy. The bad elements
    in society taking over creating misery for everyone else.

    Somalia, no stable gov, for 23 years, Warlords, rival militias,
    300,000, deaths, famine, disease.

    Authority, though sometimes tiresome, is a necessity for public
    order, and to protect the vulnerable, of which children, top the
    list. Religion cannot be an exception to the law, where a child’s
    safety is concerned. Adults have a choice, children don’t .

    Blood transfusion carries a risk as does all medical treatment,
    The next box of pills you get from the doctor, read the list of
    side effects, and you’ll feel like throwing them in the trash bin.

    Gov”s are advised by scientific , medical, and other welfare
    bodies, as knowledge improves, so does the treatment and care.
    Killer diseases have been eradicated, people living much longer

    congrats!!, We may not like how certain decisions affect us, but.
    one more child is alive with a fighting chance because of the laws
    intervention, And if you believe the Bible, gov”s are gods minister
    for your good, Rom,13/4.

    Good wishes to you.

  • December 15, 2014 at 2:20 pm
    Permalink

    congrats,

    Sir, we shall have to agree to disagree. I do not have contempt for the general population. I do not think that government is evil. I do not believe that parents have the right of total control over their children’s medical care.

    It’s fine, we don’t have to agree! We live in a free society (instituted through democracy) where we are allowed to hold different views.

    I have no need of advice from you about my thinking abilities. I do not need to pull back the microscope, thank you all the same.

    Peace be with you,

    Excelsior!

  • December 22, 2014 at 10:31 am
    Permalink

    Blood fractions allowed. So God is offended if we have
    a main component, but he doesn’t mind as long as we
    only take a fraction of it..? Is that “Abstaining”?.

    A thief steals a $10 bill, that’s a crime, he steals $1
    he’s an honest man. Who would accept such idiotic
    reasoning.? I would when I was a JW.

Comments are closed.

%d bloggers like this: